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 My living room/listening room with strange box shelving and random doors...

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Michael Green
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PostSubject: Re: My living room/listening room with strange box shelving and random doors...   Mon Oct 15, 2012 6:00 am

JD

"I did the exact same thing and it was hard to describe. If I had to say I would say the sound in my room expanded outward from center. Like the sound stage expanded in all directions, especially upward. This was a good thing. I tried different positions for the pillow but about a foot in front of and directly above my listening position sounded best.
I ran the soundstage ideas by the forces that be, and I have "full reign" to tune the shelving with sound stages. They can be used either on the front shelving or on the sides as well... I was wondering how I could turn those traps into great sounding and (nice looking) panels.... I think they would de great there... Of course talking pricing would have to be done, but your pricing always seems beyond reasonable... "

MG

Excellent! Your reports help me a ton, thanks! I have done panels like these before. What you would get would be a frame that mounted (with a turn key so the shelves you have would not get damaged) on the inside of the hole at the edge. Then, you would attach the tuning panels on the front of the frame. With your amount of panels and with a few other PZC's along with floor standers you could convert the sound of your room pretty major. As in WOW affraid major.

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PostSubject: Re: My living room/listening room with strange box shelving and random doors...   Mon Oct 15, 2012 7:19 am

JD

"Also, I'm wondering if you do any kind of ethernet or firewire cabling... or a type that you've found best at this point? Lightest possible connectors? No shielding? Flat ethernet cable vs. round ethernet cable? cat5/6/7 etc????"

MG

I don't have my own cable but have tweaked on it. Light connectors is always the way to remove stress that causes blockage. Anyone know the light weight ones let me know. Over shielding is one of the biggest problems in audio. That is over shielding and heavy jackets.

I like ribbon over round unless you take the jacket off of the round then I like round over ribbon.

I don't know about others but cat 5 stripped seems the best if, one you keep it away from transformers and two don't have it too close to power cables.

From what I am told there is something I do with cables that make them out perform others. Maybe it is the way I temper treat it and cure it, but whatever it is I seem to get good performance out of small gauge temper treat cable with little if any shielding. I have even had folks send me their cable and have me temper treat it, take off the barrel and reterminate and they liked it better. Most of them let me know though that they end up going with mine in the long run. Maybe because I tend to go for a thickness in the middle harmonics.

One thing though that I don't think people do know is I do different gauges and types of material if they request it. For me it's in the curing and rotating and other things I do to it. The thinnest interconnects I have made that I recall were 32 gauge, but I tend to stay in the 24 to 20 gauge for the results that I look for.

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Robert Harrison



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PostSubject: Re: My living room/listening room with strange box shelving and random doors...   Mon Oct 15, 2012 3:26 pm

Hey, jdparker,

Regarding what (or what not) to do with electrical connections, see some of the recent posts in my thread. Mr. Green has always spoken of loosening screws in panels and outlets, but he also heavily advises one to let an electrician do this stuff. The last thing he (or any of us) want is someone to electrocute themselves just to get better sound quality. Of course, the electrician will probably say, "What in the hell you wanna do that for?," give you a weird look and charge you double.Laughing

Robert Harrison

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jdparker



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PostSubject: Re: My living room/listening room with strange box shelving and random doors...   Wed Oct 17, 2012 4:16 am

... So I cracked all the screws I could find in my fuse box with the idea of letting things move and be free. (I know, against recommendation. But I work as a firefighter so I do understand the basics of getting/not getting zapped!) Definate jump in sound and in volume! I was really excited and didn't know why I didn't do this before. I guess I've been just trying to read all I could on Tuneland before joining in. I was so excited, I decided to try something I read here in Tuneland again... When I cracked the tight driver screws on my speakers, I could literally control the volume and dynamics with the turn of a screw... while the music was playing I could hear the change!!! This opened up my sound by leaps and bounds. Even my unassuming girlfriend said, "Wow, what did you tweak on the stereo this time... it sounds great!"
The information here is amazing for getting your sounds tuned up and sounding better and better... I can't wait til I get my MGA products. Things must really go to the next level! Wow, it came down to the turn of a single screw on one of my drivers that made a huge difference. So there's something to this tuning stuff!! lol!

Michael, my next post is going to be the measurements of all my shelving photoshopped over the photo of my living room... Hopefully this will make it easier to see where to place some soundstages in the shelving, and what sizes/dimensions... sunny sunny
Thanks for the advice on the electrical Robert! Yeah, I just couldn't bear to pay some guy for a couple turns of the screws! Hmm. Wonder how loose I can go before darkness?
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Robert Harrison



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PostSubject: Re: My living room/listening room with strange box shelving and random doors...   Wed Oct 17, 2012 11:21 am

Hey, jdparker,

You had already loosened some or all of your wall sockets, so I reckon screws on the electrical panel were no biggie for you. As you said, you have experience with that sort of thing so enjoy! As for me, my system is about to go into shock with all the changes anyway, so I can wait until some future date to get into that part of tuning. I use the word "shock" correctly I hope. If I understand my tuning lessons, a lot of changes requires a lot of settling time for everything (which affects everything else, remember) to coalesce. It looks like you are going for some big time changes yourself, so keep this in mind. Tuning is an adventure.

And, hey, kudos to your girlfriend for hearing the changes. I didn't think the majority of females gave a hoot about sound quality.

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PostSubject: Re: My living room/listening room with strange box shelving and random doors...   Wed Oct 17, 2012 12:28 pm

Very Happy Very Happy

The more we set things free the more we see where High End Audio is loosing much of their sound. Question is can they be turned? How far do they go in the over do it world before starting to make the connection that music doesn't work that way? The freedom of music is harmonious and simple. As I have said for some 30 years now, when the industry makes the move toward musical instruments they will find an entire chapter overlooked and in waiting. It makes me happy beyond what I can say when someone finds the secrets of the tune.

good job Exclamation

The system will open up even more if the tension on the wires in the fuse box can be freed. Always be thinking "too much tension equals a closed gate".

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jdparker



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PostSubject: Re: My living room/listening room with strange box shelving and random doors...   Thu Oct 18, 2012 3:30 am

Thanks Robert, but the fuse box was a little more sketchy by far. So many possibilities to move your elbow, or the side of your hand etc to complete the circuit.(I was never good at the old game "operation"... bzzzzzzzz) I had some heavy duty gloves on and tried to lean away instead of getting too close. You don't want to lean into or fall into it... If you slip, lose your balance, or get shocked you wanna at least make sure you fall away... Heck, I rent, so I probably shouldnt even be messing with it at all. But anything for good sound!!
Yes, thanks for reminding me about the settling. I've got to remember that... It's hard sometimes when all these little tricks turn up improvements!
I'll try to solve some of the tension in the fuse box, but I'm going to err on the side of caution and just chalk up a temporary win by not electrocuting myself in round one! Those wires are pretty crammed in there for some reason and it looks like it all needs a major overhaul... But if I screw up and it affects my neighbors, the landlord is going to wig out... maybe when I'm feeling adventurous again...
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jdparker



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PostSubject: Re: My living room/listening room with strange box shelving and random doors...   Thu Oct 18, 2012 3:39 am

These are some wacky diagrams of the measurements of the shelving. I don't think photoshop is my thing.
I was also told the mirror stays! No But all the other shelving is open season. Hopefully just a few of them will do the trick? I can also remove the door if needed... It really doesnt seem to effect the sound even when it's closed... hmmm

[img][/img]

[img][/img]
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PostSubject: Re: My living room/listening room with strange box shelving and random doors...   Thu Oct 18, 2012 4:25 am

Below is my idea for the cabling and the lengths needed. Of course I would like any suggestions if you have them. I only have a 4 outlet receptacle, so with all the components, I tried to spread them out, and keep the analog stuff away from the digital etc... as best as I could. Although there was no perfect solution I could think of... The power bars will go one per quadrant of the shelving, and put them closest to the center of all the components listed there, and tucked as far away from anything as possbile. I took this into account when I measured all the lengths... Is this a setup that will work?


[img][/img]
[img][/img]
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PostSubject: Re: My living room/listening room with strange box shelving and random doors...   Sat Oct 20, 2012 9:08 am

Hi JD

I have tuned just about everything over the years, but the thought of converting shelving into a tunable wall was never high on the list. However what I have done is tune window holes. I happened to have some tunable room frame wood here so since I was at the remote location and needed to setup things what better way than to make a toy for me to test. I also happen to have one area that is open to try it on. Well, should I say it was open till I popped one of these in.



WOW Shocked now I'm mad Mad I'm going to have to take the entire opening out, and the framed drywalled window area cause this blew my mind. Not only that, but I took a bookcase and converted it, put it in the front of the room and was very surprised. I then put the bookcase behind me with what was the shelving area (now tunable wall) facing the back of my head and could hardly believe the conversion. And, It's Tunable Exclamation Idea

I should go into the shelf converting business Laughing . What an unexpected jump. I thought it would be good enough to do but never thought it was going to turn into such a tool.

My weeks brief listening told me that this idea is a fantastic one and for those who have shelved walls or big book cases they can be converted into tunable walls with sound very similar to the sound of a Tunable Room.

Thought I would give some looks.


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PostSubject: Re: My living room/listening room with strange box shelving and random doors...   Sat Oct 20, 2012 11:28 am

Hey, Mr. Green,

Like I said before, creative minds are always in motion. Congratulations on another "case" solved!
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PostSubject: Re: My living room/listening room with strange box shelving and random doors...   Mon Nov 12, 2012 8:14 pm

Hi JD

Next question. I've been burning cable and have done some of yours. The question is are you planning on hard wiring.

Here's my setup



I see that you are floating anyway so why don't you have me send you the parts and you hardwire the power? The difference is beyond what I can tell you. That plug that jumps from the back of your components to your supply system cost you a ton of noise and blockage. I see on at least the Manley's you have a straight shot to hardwire and would guess the same on your other pieces.

Your interconnects and speaker cables are playing as we speak.

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