Michael Green Audio Forum

http://tuneland.techno-zone.net
 
Our Website  HomeHome  FAQFAQ  SearchSearch  MemberlistMemberlist  RegisterRegister  Log inLog in  

Share | 
 

 Robert Harrison's Tunable System

View previous topic View next topic Go down 
Go to page : Previous  1, 2, 3 ... 9, 10, 11, 12  Next
AuthorMessage
Michael Green
Admin
avatar

Posts : 3463
Join date : 2009-09-12
Location : Vegas/Ohio/The Beach

PostSubject: Re: Robert Harrison's Tunable System   Fri Jun 07, 2013 1:06 am

In that case Idea

For me there's usualy a system that I go nuts on, and system I tweak and learn, and a system that plays! At the present, the systems are all one, soon the be two. As such if I'm willing to give up the major "float" step (I'll be writing this later) I would go after a system that burns in pretty fast. One that may lean a little toward warm and wooly and not high pitched and screechy and stringy. A setup that does most things OK, but nothing really wrong or bad.

And, a comfy comfy chair Wink

For this, do you like the Pioneer sound or the Sherwood sound?

_________________
michael green
PH 702 762 3245
Email mgtune@yahoo.com
Back to top Go down
http://tuneland.techno-zone.net Online
Robert Harrison



Posts : 254
Join date : 2010-03-08
Location : Harwood Heights, Illinois

PostSubject: Re: Robert Harrison's Tunable System   Fri Jun 07, 2013 10:01 am


Hey, Mr. Green,

I will say this about the Sherwood: it behaves. I frankly can't recall "the Pioneer sound," just that I had to deal with the sound drifting over to the left side of the room because of the age of the unit. I say again, I like the convenience of having a remote control and a display to let me know where I am at volume-wise.

The most recent thing I did was bring the pressure box into this room for the first time (I had been using it during my days in the bigger room) and place it to the right of my chair and near the closet doors. It seems moving it forward, with the port facing the front of the room, has mellowed the sound. I can't decide if it is closing down the highs or doing that "warm and wooly" thing of which you speak. The bass is still there in spades (as it always has been in this room). So, I'm not going to make any more changes for a while, just listen. I'll try to get some pics soon.

Love your adventures in your new room. You're on automatic pilot with your tuning skills and even amaze yourself!

Back to top Go down
Sonic.beaver



Posts : 2145
Join date : 2009-09-18

PostSubject: Re: Robert Harrison's Tunable System   Fri Jun 07, 2013 10:30 am


Hi Robert

Sonic's experience with pressure boxes has not been good. I have tried (as you can see from my threads) several sizes with port, with toilet roll or completely sealed.

When first introduced, I heard or thought I heard a difference and might have raved about it. Over time the sound became muddy with a dull treble...sounding like 1950 amplifiers with worn out tubes. I thought that this was because the cardboard boxes were absorbing humidity over time and sounded muddy.

The flaw in this observation is the boxes were unused but not that new....certainly older than a week or two. They had enough time to absorb moisture for longer than I had them in my room.

For now I am attributing the gradually poorer sound to come from settling of the boxes in my system and room.

Sonic
Back to top Go down
Michael Green
Admin
avatar

Posts : 3463
Join date : 2009-09-12
Location : Vegas/Ohio/The Beach

PostSubject: Re: Robert Harrison's Tunable System   Fri Jun 07, 2013 3:12 pm

Hi Sonic

I'M certain that your poor results from using the boxes were indeed the cardboard getting wet. It doesn't take much at all for these boxes to turn the sound to mud. This is why I have been thinking about making them out of wood.

_________________
michael green
PH 702 762 3245
Email mgtune@yahoo.com
Back to top Go down
http://tuneland.techno-zone.net Online
Robert Harrison



Posts : 254
Join date : 2010-03-08
Location : Harwood Heights, Illinois

PostSubject: STATE OF MY MEDIA ROOM AUGUST 2013   Fri Aug 09, 2013 12:03 pm


chair on platform and left rear corner behind by ozonerman, on Flickr
 Yep, that old recliner is back in the room. I had a notion to get a bonafide listening chair, but went back to this one. The difference this time is that it is sitting on an old desktop which in turn is sitting on a couple of wooden studs. It probably wouldn't pass the Michael Green Knuckle Rap Test, but must be better than no kind of platform at all. Shoved in between the chair's cushion and the curved back is a piece of cardboard. In the left rear corner, I took down the tuning strip and put up one of the erstaz Aeroplanes, standing out just a bit from the corner. I have a tuning strip on the floor behind the chair angled up.


left front corner and center with TV by ozonerman, on Flickr
 And now let's all have a jolly good laugh at my pressure box sitting on the TV. Remember, this is a flat screen plasma, so the bottom of the front of the box is just touching the TV and top of the back end of the box is touching the wall behind. I have RT Squares straddling the ceiling corners, including the extra corner made by the soffit (the other Square near top right of pic is actually midway on the soffit; see below).

 I have another cardboard piece (actually 2 pieces taped together so I can bend it in half easily) between the Squares near the ceiling/wall junction as an ersatz Sound Shutter (don't you just love that word ersatz?) As you see, I'm still fooling around with those cardboard tubes. They have clothespins for feet and I put one of Mr. Green's circular wood pieces in the top hole, not covering it but at a 90 degree angle. I still have tuning strips in the front corners, but their length allows me to cover the center and bottom corner pressure zones, so that is why they extend to the floor.

Also, for shits and giggles, I have another tube sitting horizontally in front of the TV supported by 2 small wood cubes provided by Mr. Green.


right front corner by ozonerman, on Flickr
 Here is the same setup in the right front corner, with the tubes farther apart than the other side as I try to ameliorate my right channel speaker's tendency to call more attention to itself on bass frequencies. I've been at this for over 3 years now and I'm still trying to figure out how to master pressure zones. Mr. Green cautioned me when I moved to this room from the larger one that it wouldn't take much to go into acoustic overkill. I had been stripping things out, but I reckon I get bored and can't help trying all kinds of things to see where they take me.

 Even lately, that pressure box gave my bass a good goosing (although this room is a bass animal anyway), but the latest moves, with the tubes in the front corners and the addition of the RT Square along the soffit and the return of the tuning strip near the right speaker which I had taken down for a while, has mellowed things and brought on the "re-mix effect." It's all quite fascinating and I can see where Mr. Green has made this research his life's work (and kudos to the indefatigable Sonic Beaver in HIS never ending quest to tame that virtual concrete bunker of his).


left wall, closeup on wood piece on top of speaker by ozonerman, on Flickr
 A close-up of a wooden stud sitting atop the left channel speaker, my alternative to a brace. Behind the speaker, the tuning strip at wall center, but going down instead of across to get into the mid wall pressure zone. If I'm into overkill, this may be doing it, but we shall see.


right wall and ceiling by ozonerman, on Flickr
 Left side wall, with stud on the speaker top, tuning strip on the wall and the Square midway between front and back walls on the soffit.


right rear corner and center with chair by ozonerman, on Flickr
 And the left rear and back wall, same RT Square allotment with Aeroplane on floor corner. Another piece of cardboard hangs from the ceiling, tucked into a rail, above the chair, angled toward listener.

 To those of you new to these parts, when I say "re-mix effect," it is as if a recording has been through just that; items that were once predominant in the mix are toned down and other items come through. Occasionally, I actually come across some little tidbit that was totally MIA before and THAT is when TuneLand becomes a very interesting place.

 But now, the bad news. Still no breakthroughs on the room boundaries being shattered. The guitars stay within my room and never go anywhere near the neighbor's yard. I still suspect only so much can be done with big old panel speakers. Maybe they weren't even designed for such, as Mr. Green has been indicating with much ferocity lately; i.e. soundstage stuck in the room if not totally between the speakers was the designers intent. Either that, or I need to pay more attention to what Sonic is doing, as he has a similar model of Magnepan speakers.
Back to top Go down
Sonic.beaver



Posts : 2145
Join date : 2009-09-18

PostSubject: Re: Robert Harrison's Tunable System   Sat Aug 10, 2013 3:28 am

Hi Robert

What's that wood block on top of your Maggie panels? What's the thinking behind it, is it just wood, how heavy is it and how do you keep it falling over given the narrowness of the speaker panels?

Sonics
Back to top Go down
Robert Harrison



Posts : 254
Join date : 2010-03-08
Location : Harwood Heights, Illinois

PostSubject: Re: Robert Harrison's Tunable System   Sun Aug 11, 2013 8:24 am

Hey, Sonic,

Those pieces of wood are leftover studs from when walls were put in my basement back in the 1980s. I don't want to go the brace route with the speakers so this is my attempt to deal with what Mr. Green has said about panel speakers vibrating more on the top than on the bottom. They fit nicely and the only way they would fall is if the speakers were bumped into.
Back to top Go down
Michael Green
Admin
avatar

Posts : 3463
Join date : 2009-09-12
Location : Vegas/Ohio/The Beach

PostSubject: Re: Robert Harrison's Tunable System   Sun Aug 11, 2013 5:40 pm

Hi Robert

You are impressive!

BTW I posted this on sonic's thread and thought I would copy it to here too.

"Left room or right room drift is very common and getting away from it can be a challenge.

Must be something in the amp right?

Switch the interconnects so the amp is recieving the left in the right and the right in the left, then flip the leads on your amp to do the same thing.

This clears the amp right? Maybe

Must be the CD player?

Again flip the channels. Yes your channels are reversed but you can still hear the problem.

Must be the speakers?

Flip the leads on the speakers, still there?

Move further into the room, away from the back wall. Listen carefully, listen again, and again. When you leave the back wall your losing info. ( the distance will vary based on the materials in the wall). But lets say you have a SAM or ok wall (one that has flex). If you listen very carefully you are going to hear that the drift is still there even after you lose the info. Yes things may shift to center again but one side is still thin as opposed to the other.

It's all about signal and pressure. I should post this on Robert's thread too, cause he has brought this up a few times.

Every time I put on a piece of music in my current room I go through a bit of biting my lip. I for a moment lose a grib on the settling truth and want to start "fixing". Some times I start to go down that road and before too long am greeted with harmonic distortion to the order that I have to stop listening. This is something that I have had to just learn and face. Fixing things based on a partial signal gets me nowhere in the long run and makes me frustrated while tweaking. Instead I have taken on a better approach for me. I wait to listen until I can the music doing certain things.

In my systems (being so low mass) the change between a recording playing an hour later and it playing a day later is like a different piece of music. It's bigger than big, more like 3 or 4 times as much info. With this info comes a ton more balance and thickness (richness). Most of the time (not always) the channel out of balance comes into balance. Keep in mind, I don't make the rules, I only listen to them.

here's what I have found with drift

It's somewhere hiding and the better your system is at telling you detail and accuracy the easier it is to find it and work on it. For me it usually comes down to (a) am I doing a quick listen or settling in (b) a tweak that I have found that fixes it temporary that I can return to when needed.

Is there a perminant fix to drift?

Not in rooms with hard surfaces and limited space. I've had maybe one or two systems that never had drift at least during warm up."

_________________
michael green
PH 702 762 3245
Email mgtune@yahoo.com
Back to top Go down
http://tuneland.techno-zone.net Online
Robert Harrison



Posts : 254
Join date : 2010-03-08
Location : Harwood Heights, Illinois

PostSubject: Re: Robert Harrison's Tunable System   Fri Aug 30, 2013 1:01 pm

Hey, everybody,

 I am currently trying a different speaker orientation with my Magnepans, as shown below:

Rooze speaker setup by ozonerman, on Flickr

 For now, I will go along with calling this "The Rooze Set-Up" since a fellow by that name brought it up in some old posts I discovered recently on Audio Asylum. I brought this up on Sonic's thread and Mr. Green mentioned that when he tries something new, he starts with an empty room, by which, I reckon he means getting rid of most or all tune toys. That, taken with his advice of a year ago when I moved into this smaller room that acoustic overkill was a possibility if I used too many tunes, made me decide to go back to basics. So, most of that stuff you see in the above pictures are now out of the room: the pressure box, the floor standers, the tuning strips, the cardboard tubes and slats and the pieces of wood atop the speakers. All that remains are the 8 RT Squares (the eighth hidden behind the TV centered top to bottom and side to side on the wall, as per Mr. Green's original spec).

 Having done so, I went off on a tangent and put on my old enemy, the XLO Test and Burn-In CD, using the mono out-of-phase tracks in an attempt to get the best all over the room imaging. I call this disc my enemy because, no matter the room, configuration or components, the track that features a version of the song "Stormy Weather" ALWAYS exhibits the same ding blasted effect: some of the notes on the stand up bass image on the right wall between the speaker and the rear wall. I thought bass should be attenuated or non-existent when the phase is off between a pair of speakers, or is this another Audio Myth? As I complained about in my earliest posts, if I move over to the left, the effect is ameliorated, but then when I go back to in phase mono, the image is left of center.

 Anyway, it's like the old joke about the guy who tells his doctor "It hurts when I do that" and the doc replies "Then, don't do that." So, for now, I'll skip that disc and just listen to regular stereo music. It does concern me, though, because I don't want phantom surround effects to do the same thing when I'm watching a movie. I noticed this technique of using out of phase signals is still being brought up recently on Audiophile Review.com. A red light there is the mention that the resulting in phase image afterward should be smaller than the size of a half dollar. We don't want none of that in TuneLand!
Back to top Go down
Sonic.beaver



Posts : 2145
Join date : 2009-09-18

PostSubject: Re: Robert Harrison's Tunable System   Sat Aug 31, 2013 7:44 am

Hi Robert

Brave man you are to take the jump into the Rooze setting! What's the first thing that characterises the sound you hear, that is before you start dialling and tuning the sound in? What do you like, and what is most annoying (other than the bass pull effect) thing you hear?

First impressions are very important....that is why Sonic keeps notes.

Sonic
Back to top Go down
Robert Harrison



Posts : 254
Join date : 2010-03-08
Location : Harwood Heights, Illinois

PostSubject: Re: Robert Harrison's Tunable System   Sat Aug 31, 2013 2:29 pm

Hey, Sonic,

 As you can guess, I just put my room into major system shock, especially the night I kept moving the speakers trying to get rid of that blasted boom on the right wall. Last night, I simply put the speakers in the same relative position and listened to one of my new age/ambient/whatever mix CDs. To get to the point, no disappearing walls, but it was fine for what it was. To quote a friend of mine, "It didn't suck."

 I know I started putting more Tunes in this particular room when some movies exhibited more echo than I wanted, so I really have to watch/listen to a few of those to see what I have now.

 The interesting part of the evening was when I moved the RT Square that was in the middle of the soffit and clipped it to a ceiling rail directly over my head, hanging down, and restarted the CD. IMMEDIATELY I felt a strange pressure on my ears. I went with this for several tracks and then decided I did not like what I was experiencing. The burn side was facing into the room, so I turned it around. The damage had been done to my ears, though, they were fried, so I really couldn't see if it made a better effect. I moved the Square to the next farthest ceiling rail, but, again, my ears were fried so I quit for the night. I took that Square out of the room and will proceed with letting the room settle as is whilst I listen to this, that and the other for a while to see what I have.

 As you once mentioned, Mr. Green's RoomTunes are powerful devices. I wonder if I would have even noticed this effect if I still had all the stuff in the room that I had previously? I still think this particular design of speaker is a pain in the ass, though. I might have been better off buying some Sonus Faber mini monitors which I had been mulling when I let the rags and a book called "Good Sound" talk me into big old panel speakers.
Back to top Go down
Sonic.beaver



Posts : 2145
Join date : 2009-09-18

PostSubject: Re: Robert Harrison's Tunable System   Sun Sep 01, 2013 11:58 am

Hi Robert

As you settle into the Rooze set up, keep an eye on the image size (you won't want 10 foot wide violins and solo singers do we?)

Also listen for the treble - is your room doing its work in the Tune as the Speaker or is the treble being rolled off now that the tweeters are no longer anywhere remotely pointed in your direction but rather you are facing a null.

Sonic
Back to top Go down
Robert Harrison



Posts : 254
Join date : 2010-03-08
Location : Harwood Heights, Illinois

PostSubject: Re: Robert Harrison's Tunable System   Sun Sep 01, 2013 6:53 pm

Hey, Sonic,

 I always wonder about that NULL business. To me, a NULL would be no sound at all. And, as for that figure 8 sound dispersion, that pretty much goes against the "sound is spherical" reality. Anyway, if anything, it's the bass that's gotten quieter, but I keep falling asleep so much I can't say for sure.

 I did watch a movie last night and wouldn't you know it, but I inadvertently picked one with an awful dialogue mix. After, I put on another movie I had watched recently and it was okay. I will have to check my notes from posts made late last year to see if I had Mr. Green's ceiling panels, cables, interconnects and tuning stands when I decided I needed more burn. Or maybe the Rooze set-up IS more beneficial. As always, time will tell.

 I tried to listen to a CD last night, but kept dozing. However, that weird pressure was non-existent without the RT Square hanging overhead as happened the night before.
Back to top Go down
Robert Harrison



Posts : 254
Join date : 2010-03-08
Location : Harwood Heights, Illinois

PostSubject: Re: Robert Harrison's Tunable System   Fri Sep 20, 2013 10:26 am

Hello Tunees,

 I'm still slogging on with the "Rooze speaker set-up." I keep getting a weird pressure on my right ear which I'm not sure what to do with. I had thought maybe I needed to cut down the pressure on the right side of the room, but after adding Tuning Strips and moving around one RT Square, as well as slight moves of each speaker, that doesn't seem to do the trick.

 I feel as if the sound is brighter on the left side and more neutral on the right (the old "detail vs. brightness" thing), so perhaps I'm working on the wrong side of the room? If so, and I begin treating the left side, will that balance out that bass pressure that predominates on the right side? I have always noticed bass tends to pile up at the bottom area of the right speaker. That hard soffit overhead contributes to this, I suppose.

And, for those keeping track, no disappearing walls. I would say "the Rooze" almost accentuates the speakers calling attention to themselves when a sound is hard left or right. As I indicated when I began this experiment, the others who had successfully used "the Rooze" (or at least were satisfied with their results) had large rooms, where their Magnepans were far from ALL walls, whereas mine are, by necessity, near the side walls.
Back to top Go down
Robert Harrison



Posts : 254
Join date : 2010-03-08
Location : Harwood Heights, Illinois

PostSubject: Re: Robert Harrison's Tunable System   Sun Sep 29, 2013 8:07 am

Hey, y'all,

 As reported on Sonic's thread, I got rid of that pressure on my right ear. I had loosened the screws on the platform on which the right channel speaker sits to remedy this but it wasn't until I also loosened the screws on the left speaker platform that the pressure normalized.

 To further try to cut down on the bass imbalance on the right side of the room, I brought one of the cardboard tubes in and Commando taped it to the door situated to the right of my chair, vertically situated and centered. Listening to some new age music with a lot of insect sounds last night, I noticed some images were moving away from the panels and further along both side walls (although not through the walls) towards the rear of the room.

Mr. Green,

 Which causes you more grief? A carpeted floor or a bare cement and/or tile floor? I would guess carpet?
Back to top Go down
Michael Green
Admin
avatar

Posts : 3463
Join date : 2009-09-12
Location : Vegas/Ohio/The Beach

PostSubject: Re: Robert Harrison's Tunable System   Sun Sep 29, 2013 2:35 pm

Hi Robert

Wow, a loaded question! There's so many variations of carpet and tile that this is a hard one. Pading and shag are out, but so is concrete directly. Tile however if clay or some type of material that has a little body to it is tough but doable if platforms are used. Poly berber with a wooven back can also work (kinda). With both of these it depends on how good the rest of the room sounds and if the platforms make a match with the surface. Platforms are the over looked most important product in the hobby when we are talking about things that sit on the floor (any floor). Very rarely do I find a floor any more that can have direct transfer to it without loosing something.

With both carpet and tile that transfer point can be so touchy and very hard to find a balance that fits a lot of different music. I also should mention that this is me talking in dry air. In places where the is humidity both carpet and tile take on a whole new level of pain. During my brief stay in Ohio last year when I set up my system on the concrete I about ran for cover the sound was so messed up. It reminded me of the different levels of TuneVilla where part of the main listening house was on joist and the lower on the concrete. The sound difference was shocking to say the least and it wasn't long before the lower level floor needed to be floored. The same has happened every time I had a concrete floor. Getting away from that concrete sound is a must in my book.

In your case this could easily be what is keeping your sound inside of the room. In Sonics case I would say it is because of the lack of wood vibrating in the room. If I were Sonic that bookcase would be empty or I would put a SAM wall in front of it. In your case a raised floor made of Music Ply would be awsome.

Watch what I am doing to my upstairs room, it might give some hints. Even just putting the chair on the tuned frame and music ply made a big difference. Of course though I am sitting on floor joist where you are on the lower level. Bill333 has been in a battle with this Chicago lower level sound himself and it has been an interesting journey to get this concrete sound that flows up into the system under control. Even with the framed floor you can still heard the concrete some what. Because of this we have spent a lot of time voicing his circuit box and equipment platform. But the biggest problem at Bill's was the room itself going through some bad construction that needed to be corrected, and because of I only just now am hearing what the room is even doing.

I can hear fairly easy the particular sound you guys are dealing with in your area because of doing a few systems there. The sound cues are all pretty much the same and the problems that are at one place translates to the next. I think a lot of you guys sound character actually is because of the type of ground you are sitting on so close to the lake. It may not seem that close but the further you get from the lake area the more the ground changes and so does the sound of the bedrock and concrete in your lower levels. I have heard this sound now for years as I have work on rooms in that general area including my Ohio locations. The ground in the midwest "lake" area has this moist sound that is kind of tacky sounding. Instead of blump and dry it's kind of blump and wooly as if the wool was soaked. I hear this everytime I come home from a trip and listen. I'm trying to come up with words to describe it so it makes sense. Don't know if it's translating but I guess what I'm trying to say is when I listen out there it sounds like I'm listening on a rainy day here where it has been raining for several days. I compare this to your dry days. In your area to me it never sounds truly dry and this comes up through the lower levels, through the concrete and up into the system. If we pulled up your concrete floor I'm sure we would find a moist foundation underneigh. I would guess that this freezes in the winter and gets moist again during the warm season, but never truly dries out. Here it's the opposite. Even when it gets wet it never truly gets wet. Underneigh the surface it's dry as a bone. Because of this materials here have a totally different sound than there.

If I were to perscribe a floor for you based on what I have heard it would be one that was a raised floor out of low tone redwood and not even sitting directly on the floor but be up on shims. On top would be .75 music ply. Oh my would this ever be huge! And if dehumidified once in a while, wow.

_________________
michael green
PH 702 762 3245
Email mgtune@yahoo.com
Back to top Go down
http://tuneland.techno-zone.net Online
Robert Harrison



Posts : 254
Join date : 2010-03-08
Location : Harwood Heights, Illinois

PostSubject: Re: Robert Harrison's Tunable System   Sun Oct 06, 2013 8:39 am

Hey, Mr. Green,

I haven't been able to log onto the TuneLand Archives for the last couple of days. I hope all that valuable information hasn't suddenly gone bye-bye.
Back to top Go down
Sonic.beaver



Posts : 2145
Join date : 2009-09-18

PostSubject: Re: Robert Harrison's Tunable System   Sun Oct 06, 2013 11:09 am


Hi Robert

I'm logged in.

Have you tried your Magneplanars with some toe-in?

Sonic
Back to top Go down
Robert Harrison



Posts : 254
Join date : 2010-03-08
Location : Harwood Heights, Illinois

PostSubject: Re: Robert Harrison's Tunable System   Sun Oct 06, 2013 2:42 pm

Hey, Sonic,

Have you been able to get onto the OLD TuneLand, what we now refer to as "The Archives?" That's what I was referring to.
Back to top Go down
Michael Green
Admin
avatar

Posts : 3463
Join date : 2009-09-12
Location : Vegas/Ohio/The Beach

PostSubject: Re: Robert Harrison's Tunable System   Sun Oct 06, 2013 3:56 pm

Hi Robert

I have noticed this too. It's out there floating around somewhere, but where and why is a mystery. If it doesn't reappear I will need to see if an IT can find and fix it.

Oh info where are you?

come back aunti em

_________________
michael green
PH 702 762 3245
Email mgtune@yahoo.com
Back to top Go down
http://tuneland.techno-zone.net Online
Sonic.beaver



Posts : 2145
Join date : 2009-09-18

PostSubject: Re: Robert Harrison's Tunable System   Tue Oct 08, 2013 11:50 am

Hi Robert

Any thoughts or experiences on changing the toe-in of your Magneplanars?

I found that I need to get control ceiling to floor at the four corners of my room to get soundstage expansiveness. I get size an girth but I still cannot get a beyond the room soundstage except for an occasional hint.

Your thoughts or comments on any experiments you tried to get his out-of-room effect with your Magneplanars?

Sonic
Back to top Go down
Robert Harrison



Posts : 254
Join date : 2010-03-08
Location : Harwood Heights, Illinois

PostSubject: Re: Robert Harrison's Tunable System   Wed Oct 09, 2013 8:48 pm

Hey, Sonic,

 I have decided to stop struggling with my Magnepans and try a pair of monitor speakers (forum rules preclude mentioning the name and model, since they aren't from Mr. Green; let's just say I kept the price below $1000). When they arrive, looks like next week, I will basically have to start from scratch. You know the drill: I will begin by putting them in the same spot and listen to see what's different and is the difference better or worse. I am locked into the Magnepan "sound" having had 2 different models for many years (I started with a smaller one) so it will be interesting to see if they broaden my horizons any (or go beyond my walls).
Back to top Go down
Robert Harrison



Posts : 254
Join date : 2010-03-08
Location : Harwood Heights, Illinois

PostSubject: Re: Robert Harrison's Tunable System   Fri Oct 11, 2013 5:46 pm

Hey, everybody,

 From about 1997 to 2004 (or so) I kept notes about the things I did concerning sound (as well as forays into tuning my TV). I looked back on those notes today to find that originally that splash of out-of-phase energy was located on the left wall, but had moved to the right wall a couple of years later. I had multiple speakers in those days, the typical "home theater" arrangement. They were standard dome tweeter and cone driver types, so even with those I had that same damn problem and that was in the bigger room. Is my place haunted?

 Anyway, I had floor standers in the front and monitor types in the back (surrounds). At one point, I moved the monitors on their stands to the front to hear what the difference would be. My notes say that I heard more detail, but after 2 days I returned them to the rear of the room. The only thing I mentioned was that the floorstanders were "more dimensional."

 Having not heard of "settling," I never really gave anything a chance. If it didn't gel in as little time as "immediately," I tried something else. Gee whiz, sometimes several moves of a speaker and/or my chair in one session. Talk about chasing your tail!

 This is a prelude to me reminding myself that when I get the new set of monitors, to let them settle (along with the customary break-in). I have to remember what Mr. Green has warned about that "newness sound" and how one needs to go through the "stages" (man, I love to use quote marks, don't I?) of how the sound will change during these early days.

 And now, a question for Mr. Green. Have you ever met or heard of Mike Vans Evers. From what I have read, he seems to be the only other guy out there who has spoken of tuning resonances. He seems to have dropped out of sight, though.
Back to top Go down
Michael Green
Admin
avatar

Posts : 3463
Join date : 2009-09-12
Location : Vegas/Ohio/The Beach

PostSubject: Re: Robert Harrison's Tunable System   Fri Oct 11, 2013 8:35 pm

Hi Robert

Yes I have met Mike. He did a much heavier form of tuning but still if there would have been or be people that would rise up along this line of thinking it would certainly bring awareness up to the level of being noticed.

Mike was one of those early on who sent us some of his products to see if it fit in with the tuning big picture. It still leaned a little on the too much side for us but I wish these types of guys were in the industry and somehow would band together to make some noise.

The industry is restless and I can read in the show reports and some of the online chat how the clients are seeing through the "high dollar" bull finally.

The industry is going to try to make a move toward a new format but it will fail in sound next to the redbook. In the long run some wise listeners are going to come along and start talking about the magic in the Redbook CD's and be making comparisons between them and vinyl as apposed to the high rez stuff moving even further away from real and warmth.

The high end audio industry is backing itself into a non marketable corner, but for me I look forward to seeing listeners making the turn away from this movement and back to what makes good sound.

Really looking forward to your dynamic adventure and the moving away from the panels.

Sonic will be watching this like a hawk I'm sure and it will be interesting as I believe you said they were not free resonant types of monitors.

Are you keeping the maggies around to compare?

_________________
michael green
PH 702 762 3245
Email mgtune@yahoo.com
Back to top Go down
http://tuneland.techno-zone.net Online
Robert Harrison



Posts : 254
Join date : 2010-03-08
Location : Harwood Heights, Illinois

PostSubject: Re: Robert Harrison's Tunable System   Fri Oct 11, 2013 10:44 pm

Hey, Mr. Green,

 That is correct, the speakers are supposed to be virtually inert, though I suppose one could still loosen the screws holding the drivers to the cabinet and any other screws, if the cabinet hasn't been glued together. You must have done the slow palm down the face when I mentioned inert ("Does this fella learn NOTHING?"), but the planar speakers weren't exactly tunable, either. For that matter, who DOES have tuning bolts except you?

The planars aren't going anywhere. I'm not one of those guys that puts something up for sale immediately, if ever. I still have the old pre-amp and mono amps sitting around, not to mention the Pioneer receiver. I have half a notion to bring the TV back into the big room and hook up all that unused equipment, but just a HALF notion, mind you. I never seem to be that critical of sound quality when watching TV shows and movies. Then, of course, the smaller room would be music only. But...
Back to top Go down
Sponsored content




PostSubject: Re: Robert Harrison's Tunable System   

Back to top Go down
 
Robert Harrison's Tunable System
View previous topic View next topic Back to top 
Page 10 of 12Go to page : Previous  1, 2, 3 ... 9, 10, 11, 12  Next
 Similar topics
-
» Tactile Monitoring System
» Robert Sweet (Stryper) NOT playing on the new album!
» Excellent foundation sound system blog!
» Robert Plant Band of Joy
» Babylon System- More Roots From Cornerhouse Hi Fi

Permissions in this forum:You cannot reply to topics in this forum
Michael Green Audio Forum :: Listener's Forum :: Home Audio Systems-
Jump to: