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PostSubject: Re: Michael's System   Fri May 05, 2017 11:30 pm

A TuneLand Test

While working on the speaker line I conducted a test with the 6.5" woofer. I've conducted this same test in the past so I was just realigning (no pun) my thinking.

I setup a pair of monitors using the MGA woofer so that the soundstage was great but put the speakers in a place in the big room where the bass tapped out at around 70Hz. The room was mildly treated. Next I took a 3rd speaker (same design) and treated it like I would a subwoofer. It took a while to find the right spot and the spot was in a weird place, but when I found it the bass dropped to the low 40's. With a little tuning of this subwoofer of sorts the system was hitting some nice bass notes, I'm guessing 40 maybe even a couple of surprising notes in the mid to high 30's.

Does this mean I'm going to use a 6.5" woofer for my sub? Of course not Rolling Eyes What this does mean is our speaker placements have a connection to our rooms that is a listening science all of it's own merits.

now back once again to Sonic's comments about the bigger woofers

I do believe that bigger surface space results in bigger and lower bottom end. What I question the audiophile theorist on is the why. Larger membranes of similar mass produce lower fundamentals and wider (not squeezed) harmonics. When I say mass, I'm referring to mass that has the ability to have sympathetic responses to sound.

the air movement guys

Speakers that are based on air movement are a specific type of speaker design. They originated for spaces that are much larger than an audiophile listening room. Pull up Eminence speakers and look at the design camps and you will find something interesting. Take the Eminence Kappalite 3015 Neo 15" Speaker for example (BTW I love Eminence speakers), you'll see they referenced at 40Hz. Now take a look at the Dayton Audio DC380-8 15", you'll see they referenced at 20Hz. The Kappalite pushes far more air than the Dayton Audio, which goes much lower because it vibrates at a lower frequency, even though it pushes far less air.

I'll try to get pics up of some of the subwoofers I'm using and then the production models coming out so we can talk about the room, the mains and the subs. I think you guys will find this interesting. I also think this will help many of you in making the decisions between mains and mains & subs.

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PostSubject: Re: Michael's System   Sun May 07, 2017 2:12 am

Took a break to do some listening to the LOW speakers.


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PostSubject: Re: Michael's System   Wed May 10, 2017 10:37 am

Got all kinds of busy happenings over the last 3 weeks.

listening to



I've had so many questions about the new speaker lines that I need to go back and see what info I have posted and start putting them all in one place.

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PostSubject: Re: Michael's System   Fri May 12, 2017 4:29 am

Home sweet home Smile

In Room#3 (the home of Big Red) I've enjoyed my time while the A25-M was busy visiting the AXPONA 2017 show. The Sherwood does so many cool things and is so flexible that you really can't fault it, with two exceptions. One, it really shows itself off more when used with an MGA sub (or two). Using a sub with the 4105 brings to life a harmonic structure that is close without the sub, but with comes a sense of fullness that seems very natural and almost meant to be. That can and should be said for most amp/speaker combos.


what I'm listening to right now

I've removed the Sherwood, prepared the Audolici A25-M by removing the cover and feet, plugged in a fresh Bare Essence Type#1 Power cord, and will be putting in a fresh pair of Picasso ICs later when the time is right.

I've decided to keep Bill Evans on for a while, at least till the stage finds it's footing which already has to a great degree. I'm looking forward to the next few days of settling. I'll tell you what though, as much as I have fine tuned the Sherwood and gotten to know it's ins and outs, and trust the sound, the A25-M has this textural layering that is unmistakable and for me captivating. So far in my listening it's the only amp that I feel does the tune without needing to be totally stripped.

I can appreciate high end audio once more, with a grain of salt, because I've come to the point that I realize very few people are going to get as crazy as me, when it comes to tuning, in my lifetime. I realize that if I would have stayed front and center from the late 90's on, the tuning revolution might have changed the tide. However I don't think the press was or even today is ready for such a major turnaround. With the new momentum we have had in this last year or so the awareness has grown, but tuning needs a big engine and dedicated tunees who are able to fuel that engine in public like I did in the early 90's. I'll talk more about that later, some day Smile . For now, Audolici has taken me to the place of hope that wasn't there for a long time. As you guys know there hasn't been a ton of high end audio products from the late 90's till maybe 2013 that I have been all that crazy about. I have poured my soul so heavily into fine tuning that high end audio componentry didn't stand a chance when it came down to what really makes sense with getting the purity I demanded and turned people onto. I've put everything on the line, several times scratch thinking "since so many are saying this makes perfect sense, and those who do learn how to tune find a whole new hobby that sets listening and listeners free, it's a no-brainer" Shocked Well, scratch guess what Mr. Green life is short, a lot shorter than it needs to be, and even though tuning is so simple to me and for me, high end audio is not going to spin on the dime they should just for me Smile

I could have hung my hat and said "I'll do the rest of my designing and only use stripped down parts and pieces", and when Coop told me about Audolici there was a big part of me that wasn't interested in the slightest, and I told him so "this is going to have to be something really special and I need you to know I'm not good at pulling punches". You guys have come to know that about me bom . This is my life's calling and adventure and even though I see many cave into their own forms of mediocrity or compromise in their jobs or have separated themselves, who they are vs what they do, there's something inside of me that pushes me to survive the small stuff (like living) and do what I do the best I can regardless if anyone else buys in or not. Tough talk I know, but it's who I really am. I'm very thankful for the people who have come to know me as that person, and accepted me, and allowed me to be a true student (and maybe master I guess Laughing ) of the tune.

I've had 3 A25-Ms. The first one, frankly wasn't my cup of tea. It was designed to be too far inside the lines from what I've heard. Don't get me wrong, it wasn't a bad amp, I could just tell I was going to have to completely strip it down to the point where it was no longer a component. The second one (the black one you've seen in pictures) was a revelation, "this designer Valeriy Kuchkovskky can design" Exclamation I was able to do stuff with the black model that I haven't seen in the last 20 years, and that amazing layering was spot on. I could have lived with this model. It would have been a choice I could go to for a particular type of sound I wanted, "OK maybe I can step back into high end componentry a little". Then the next one came (you've seen me name it Big Red). I'll come back to why 3 different ones. I said I'm a tough guy on components, especially high end audio components, cause they are ridiculous. nuff said affraid


AUDOLICI A25-M MG's reference tube amplifier

I don't remember getting on the phone so quick to someone after my first listening session as I did with Coop. "what's going on?". I interrogated Harold (poor Coop Laughing ) about what has happened. "this is not the same amp" Exclamation Harold must have felt like he was staring down the barrow of a gun. I told Coop, "I can live with the sound I got from the black model, but it's not where I truly need to go. It can be A reference but not 'The' reference, or at least not the reference I ultimately need with tubes. HOWEVER Shocked your never getting the red amplifier back" Exclamation I said "wait till you come hear this thing". Well, I left a lot out of this story, but Coop did make it out here and I had him sit in the room as I compared amps. Long story short (if that's possible with mg Laughing ) both the silver and black amps were shipped back to Valeriy to be upgraded to the, well I guess what can I say, the mg version of the A25-M.

I know folks who bought their A25-M at AXPONA got the mg version and we've been getting their feedback. They're pretty freaked out. Makes me very happy that these guys came to the show (some price no object) and walked out with the same amp and sound I love so much. I'm even more happy that Valeriy is the real deal in amplifier designing. When my other two A25-M's get here I will do a full sonic comparison to make sure there is that consistency, but once Valeriy told Harold what was the difference in the designs I feel confident that when someone orders the MG Version that's what they will get.

SO study

For those of you who have been asking "what do I really think?" this can serve as a reference for you to follow me. I'm thorough and don't take my referencing lightly. I also try to be fair, but don't pull my punches because I'm a part of the marketing family for any given product. It makes no sense for this guy who has been true to my craft since my first concert playing blue grass at 13 to all of a sudden sell out, no sense at all. I also don't expect that anyone else listens like any other person so I will have equipment here that do other specifics outside of my personal tastes in listening. I'll be a ton more honest than good or bad, I'll be specific. Keep in mind however that I need to be able to take my own personal references to any place I want to go with any recording, that's a must for me, and a must for my job. Let me use the MG Version of this amp (which has become the accepted model from the factory so I am told) as an example. In my referencing and designing I need products that can go from the audiophile super detailed and analytical to the extreme of openness and everywhere in between. If a product is not able to get me close to that, my designing will become inaccurate and in conflict with my goals. So moving forward I hope this helps folks understand where I'm coming from.

shifting gears a little while I'm thinking about it

Now's the time to have this talk with you because of the production runs being done. I want to be able to be as specific and direct as I can with all of you, as we together make your choices on my stuff. This in some ways is a different chapter of me for many of you who remember me from the early Chameleon or Rev days, and certainly for those of you who know me from the in-between years.

As things take place I'll try to keep you up to date, but for starters.

Feel free to start setting up visiting listening sessions with me here at TuneLand Vegas. I recommend booking yourself for a couple of days here in Vegas because I'm going to stick with my weird schedules and that means I don't setup times so specific that it catches me at a bad time, when my mind is somewhere else. I want to have TuneLand be something that stays true to my Vibe. But don't worry I live here and will be around when your around Basketball . Second, it's not our plan to do big production runs. Maybe someday when I'm long gone, but I want to enjoy this phase of my life as much as I can and share it with you and not get into that whole empire building thing. The US is not setup for medium size companies and I'm not going down that route again. My hope is that everything stays cool and gets cooler yet, and we can do reasonable runs where I can be a part of the QC, listening wise. I think within this year we should have a fair idea of how big we are going to be, and want to get. As you know we're just getting the speakers rolling and I believe that will determine the driving force of how big. Kinda nice to hear me talk this way after so many years isn't it Very Happy . Well I think it's pretty cool too.

thanks for your orders, you guys have been wonderful, and thanks to you guys who are just now getting on board

Also, for those guys who have been asking retail pricing and color choices, I'll try to get this up next week. Those of you who have contacted me behind the scenes lets go ahead and get your goodies cooking for you.

And now I got an Audolici and LOW system to go listen to.

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Last edited by Michael Green on Fri May 12, 2017 5:27 pm; edited 4 times in total
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PostSubject: Re: Michael's System   Fri May 12, 2017 9:59 am

System 3 update



Just put in the Picasso Type 1 Interconnect, so now I'm running all Type 1 through the whole system, with the exception of the power cord for the Maggie. That will be another step during the burn in of the newer cables. I was a little surprised how much more clarity there was from the other audiophile cable (won't mention the name to save any embarrassment). I'm trying to think of any area of the other cable's sound that I like better. I thought maybe more full on the bottom end but much woolier, then a bass line played and nope, the Picasso had way better definition, depth and a note lower. Once this is all good and burned in I'll do the same thing only using all Type 2. In the end I'll do other cabling so I can find different flavors or parts of other cables that do things mine won't. Then of course I'll need to find how to get what they do out of mine, and so on the fun goes.

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PostSubject: Re: Michael's System   Sun May 14, 2017 12:48 am

Equipment Update

Hi Guys

Should be getting my Audio Note 'Paladin' in about a week.



Been a while since I played with a 2 watt-er Smile

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PostSubject: Re: Michael's System   Sun May 14, 2017 10:33 am

Hi Michael,

Wow, I'm surprised. This is a big departure from the Pioneer and Sherwood receivers that have been standards for so long. What speakers are you going to pair them with?

Are you reviewing these, or trying them out for your own use? Or is it that Harold is carrying Audio Note now?
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PostSubject: Re: Michael's System   Sun May 14, 2017 2:17 pm

Hi Bill

First off let me say welcome to my thread and I'm excited about your posting more.

Now that Harold and I have been working together for a while, we have been looking into fine tuning the lines carried by Sound Consultant and what to place here at TuneLand Vegas. There are several types of listeners inquiring about the place here, so what I am doing is, behind the scenes, bringing in componentry and seeing how it tunes and or relates to the new line of speakers as well as a couple other models of speakers coming in.

I'm not reporting on the audio rejects (products that are so stuck in their sound that there's not much sense for me to work on or with), cause I don't want to put those products in a bad light for anyone else. Saying that, because I now have 6 listening areas, I'm able to focus on my extreme tuning as well as spread myself out to different levels of the sport. People can order any of the products Coop carries, but I'm cherry picking the products I want to use. Some stock, some partially tortured, some broken down to a state of what I would consider highly tunable and some extreme tuning. It's a little bit like what we did back when I looked at some of your components (Red Wine, Altmann so on), but with a lot more rooms and flexibility.

You might not be able to see this from the outside looking in, but Sound Consultant products are evolving into mg choices and some choices that, you the Tunees, have suggested. I'm trying to keep it subtle (how am I doing Smile ) but there's a lot of stuff flowing through these doors for evaluation. Plus a lot of designers are talking to us about having their products put in TuneLand, but for me they must be products that have a purpose. And, I don't want too many products here, so we've made arrangements so we can bring things in and out as kinda a borrow, test, and return type of thing.

Hopefully no one is too shocked by my choices Very Happy

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PostSubject: Re: Michael's System   Sun May 14, 2017 3:04 pm

Bill said

"This is a big departure from the Pioneer and Sherwood receivers that have been standards for so long."

mg

The Sherwood 4105 is still on my reference hit list. The Pioneer however, that you sent me, didn't have the same stardom quality as the ones I had before. I would die to have 3 or 4 of them here to play with, but they would need to start out stock and I would go from there down to where I wanted to stop. Some of the products can actually get past the point of no return until you back up and find that little part & piece or setting that makes them do that thing they do so well. The 3400 'sound' is on my hit list still but the actual unit sent to me would have to be given some attention to make it part of the demo team.

Also on my listening hit list are the MA700 Marantz mono blocks.

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PostSubject: Re: Michael's System   Mon May 15, 2017 2:38 pm

Bill333 wrote:
Hi Michael,

Wow, I'm surprised.  This is a big departure from the Pioneer and Sherwood receivers that have been standards for so long.  What speakers are you going to pair them with?  

Are you reviewing these, or trying them out for your own use?  Or is it that Harold is carrying Audio Note now?

Yes, Bill, I have been an Audio Note dealer for many years (as you saw at AXPONA with the speakers and the cables).  It always has been and remains one of my most inquired and best sold lines I have carried.  They make music their first priority, and are one of the only companies in the world that makes every component of the audio chain (with the exception of audio furniture, acoustics and other accessories), so you can indeed have a complete Audio Note system from front to back.  These amps are single-ended (not push-pull) and actually have 3W, not 2!  They will be coming with vintage RCA 2A3's.  In the near field with speakers of 90dB+, they should be wonderful! In no time at all we'll be making Audio Note magic in Vegas.

www.soundconsultant.com
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PostSubject: Re: Michael's System   Mon May 15, 2017 9:01 pm

Hi guys

We are inching ever so closely to giving you the new speaker lineups and retail pricing and options.

here's a peak at the new entry level models, the Revolution line


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PostSubject: Re: Michael's System   Fri May 19, 2017 3:49 pm

Hi TuneLand

I wanted to post some pictures (I know I'm a terrible photographer  Laughing  ) before completing my platform station in area one, mainly so you can see a standalone Sonata Platform Rack.



The main difference between this rack and the stock model is the thickness of the side transfer plates and that this one is screwed and not bolted where the platform meets the plates. You'll understand when the whole platform unit is put together for the display version.

When you walk in the front door your greeted with a wall full of components, and I want to have this more than just a typical stereo store looking display. I want everything at TuneLand Vegas to have a function when at all possible.

As you walk through the place hopefully we will have several levels of tuning on display (all the way to top tuning). The Tunable Room being the last room on the tour (coming slow but sure). The place will make more sense when you do visit as I will have stock product to look at and listen to, sitting on tunable surfaces and as you explore you will see how far you might want to go and how to choose products at each level.

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PostSubject: Re: Michael's System   Fri May 19, 2017 11:15 pm

Well the day rolls on, and as each piece of the puzzle presents itself, I'm finding myself stopping to make adjustments so the tonality of the platform contraption has a good general setting.



As you can probably tell by now area 1 & 2 share the same space. It's been interesting to put system two on while working on system one's furniture and hearing how they are starting to play off of each other. I've also been switching out speakers on system two. I could spend a year just exploring these changes, but getting the space setup is priority.

I think Smile

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PostSubject: Re: Michael's System   Fri May 19, 2017 11:34 pm

Stage 2 of the setup is now functional (tuning stand wise), and look who we have here Shocked



Why is that the new 270-E Accuphase Integrated Amplifier with the optional phono stage Question  It certainly looks like it to me Razz

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PostSubject: Re: Michael's System   Yesterday at 4:21 pm

This morning I started to put together the last section that I want to use. This allows me to use 7 components on this unit. 7 Platforms 'that's pretty cool'.



Turning the music on, I felt it appropriate to play Mozart.

Just received my new Kodak and here is the first pic as well as a little wider view of area 1.


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PostSubject: Re: Michael's System   Today at 9:05 am


Hi Michael

What turntable and cartridge is that?

Is it tuned in any way, what arm/cartridge alignment setting did you use?

Sonic


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